Closed captions not working in Australia

Channels Apple TV
#7

Please send us a video sample from the captioned channel and I will see what’s up.

Capture a short sample video from http://HDHOMERUN:5004/auto/vCHANNEL?duration=30 and send it to [email protected].

For example, if your hdhomerun’s ip is 10.0.1.1 and the channel number having issues is 12, visit this URL in chrome: http://10.0.1.1:5004/auto/v12?duration=30

#8

I just sent you a sample from channel 21 that I know was showing closed captions at the time as I was checking it through the regular TV.

#9

Thanks for the sample. It looks like your channels are using the dvb teletext format instead of the dvb subtitle format we expect. I thought that teletext was used only for full screen text UIs, but I guess it is used for subtitling as well?

We will need to do some more research and see if we can add support for teletext. I’m curious if you see the same problem on HD channels as well. A sample from an HD channel would be appreciated.

#10

Yes, subtitles working in the UK. :slight_smile:

#11

I’m no expert about this but my understanding is that closed captions for Australian TV are (or at least were) delivered via page 801 of the teletext service. This seems to be confirmed by this Wikipedia entry: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austext

The problem exists for HD channels just the same as SD.

You might be able to find out more about closed captions for Australian TV using this website: https://www.acma.gov.au/Citizen/TV-Radio/Television/Captioning

I’ve sent you a follow-up email that includes links to an SD and HD recording of the same 30 seconds of TV.

#12

SD Captioning is via Line 21/334, HD Captioning is via Ancillary Data.

@tmm1 I’ve linked below to the Australian FreeTV Operational Practice standards documents for both SD (OP42) and HD (OP47) Closed Captioning, maybe this will help you?

OP42
OP47

Let us know if you want to test anything.

StephenH

1 Like
#13

I’ve added support for AU closed captioning in the latest beta build of our app and sent you invites to try it out. Please try it and let me know how it works.

#14

If we are talking about ATV Beta 2018 (4.14.116) …

It doesn’t … for me anyway …
I’ve never been able to see ANY captions here in Sydney, on either HD or SD channels, including with this latest beta.

StephenH

#15

When you swipe down does it show any subtitle options?

#16

Yep, Closed Captions “Off” and “English” so I select “English” (so it is ticked).

I noticed that when you first go into the menu “Off” is not ticked either - this may just be a cosmetic GUI fault but I mention it anyway.

StephenH

#17

Thanks for working on this feature.

I just tested it and it doesn’t work for me either.

I tested it with a channel that I knew contained captions at the time (I checked it via the regular TV tuner) and no captions appeared.

I tried turning captions off and on again a few times via the Language menu but that didn’t help.

Note that every time I re-entered the Language menu, neither option (Off/English) was ticked.

#18

Aman,

Diagnostics submitted after a reboot of ATV 4K, after attempting to turn on subtitles a couple of times on an HD show known to have captions.

If it’s any comfort they don’t work on Plex either using same tuners :slight_smile:

Submitted here as well as realised my other answer on this was in wrong thread!

StephenH

#19

Please test new beta build

#20

Hi Aman,

Captions are now showing up and the issue with the Off/English checkmark always missing when re-entering the Language menu seems to be resolved.

There are a number of other issues, though:

  1. The captions are relatively small, making them difficult to view from a distance.
  2. The captions don’t respect the style/size settings set under “Settings > General > Accessibility > Subtitles and Captioning”.
  3. The captions aren’t cleared from the screen until the next caption shows up (when watching on regular TV, the captions appear to have some kind of expiry time).
  4. The caption blocks aren’t aligned properly. On regular TV, caption blocks are often placed on the left or right side of the screen, depending where the speaker is located in the scene.
  5. The caption text is not coloured correctly. On regular TV, captions are often coloured differently to identify the current speaker.
  6. Within the caption block, text is centre-aligned whereas on regular TV, text is left-aligned (which makes it easier to read when captions are being updated live).
  7. When rewinding and playing the same section of video in Channels, sometimes a particular caption will get “stuck”, and will not be replaced by the caption that is meant to follow that one.

I’m preparing some videos that will demonstrate each of these issues. I’ll email you links to the videos once they’re ready.

#21

Please send photo comparing size in our app vs TV.

Known issue- Apple does not provide any APIs for us to read this setting.

What is the expiry time used on the TV? I can’t seem to find any documentation about this.

#22

I thought there was no “expiry time” as such, but a caption cleardown command to remove them. Maybe Channels is not honouring this? You might be able to see this effect if the last caption on a show was staying on screen for a long time …, maybe even all down through the credits until the first caption on the next show?

I can’t test this right now it’s just a theory …

StephenH

1 Like
#23

@jurnip seems to have it pretty well covered … I’m just confirming that closed captions are now working fine for me too in Sydney.

I don’t think the sizing is TOO bad … but on a smaller TV I can see there could be issues, so I guess the answer is to make it user-configurable within Channels app.

StephenH

#24

I’ve now confirmed my theory! :slight_smile:

I watched the end of a show that had subtitles/closed captions.
The last caption of that show stayed on screen past the end of the show, through the promo break of about 3 minutes, and only got replaced when the first caption of the next show came on screen.

I think Channels (tvOS App at least) is not responding to the “clear caption” commands at all.

StephenH

#25

I’ve just emailed you supporting images/videos for the seven issues I outlined above and I included some photos comparing the font sizes.

I would go with what @stephenh says about the “clear caption” command. The standards that @stephenh posted earlier (Closed captions not working in Australia) make mention of it too.

#26

The clearing issue might be fixed in the latest beta. I’m not sure as I don’t have any video samples that switch between programs and commercial breaks to test with.