I just read some terrible news on Cord Cutters News. The FitzyTV folks have apparently had a run in with Adobe and are removing all TVE channels.
Cord Cutters News
The Streamable
Has any contact been made yet from Adobe to Fancy Bits LLC? If so, where do you stand? If not, will this decision by FitzyTV push you guys to disable the feature and will you give us customers a heads up?
something still doesn't add up to me as to how fitzy handled this entire situation. the apps were pulled with literally no explanation for over a month, then suddenly they came up with this adobe story (while ignoring the fact that channels is effectively the same thing and is still functional and available in all app stores). the whole time, they continued taking money from people and allowing new signups for a service that has effectively been crippled for almost three months now.
today on reddit, they commented on someone's question about this and just said "it wouldn't surprise me if they're (channels) next," as if adobe and their lawyers couldn't do multiple cease and desist / DMCA claims at the same time.
their entire story just doesn't add up to me. never has.
that being said, i'm still hoping the devs here will comment on this.
I agree. Would appreciate a response from DEVs here. I had a scare this evening as I was unable to access any TVE sources this evening and then ran across this thread. I was able to sign in directly to any channel app individually, but not access any content through Channels DVR. Anyway, after waiting an hour, it apears to work now, but would appreciate a response from the DEVs as to any ongoing discussion with Adobe that might potentially end similarly for FancyBit or not.
I absolutely LOVE the TVE integration, and I hope it remains a part of Channels. But I have questioned from the start how long it could last. I too would appreciate a response from the Channels team.
In Fitzy's case, the App was logging in to TVE sites and displaying streams. It's very believable that Adobe complained to the app stores and got Fitzy taken down as a result. Small developers get screwed like that all the time. I don't think Channels will have the same problem. Their actual app doesn't know anything about TVE. The DVR server has all the TVE code.
And there is nothing remotely illegal or immoral about what Channels is doing. The fact we even feel like it might be just goes to show how badly the big media companies have abused us over the years. ChannelsDVR is a program that runs on our own computers in our own homes to record TV from public websites the networks themselves provide to us as paying customers. That's it. If they don't like it, they can stop offering it on their websites.
I can't see them commenting on hypothetical legal matters in these public forums. I know I wouldn't if I were them. If there's not an issue, I bet they plan to keep the integration.
Could this be as simple as Channels DVR does not use Adobe technology? Doesn't Channels use Chromium and isn't that unencumbered by Adobe technology? I don't know how Fitzy worked, but perhaps they embedded some Adobe technology in their solution.
Adobe claims they power the TVE system for the cable industry. Whatever that means
From what I understand..
Adobe is a separate product you purchase that can handle TVE authentication with single sign-on. Fitzy was using this tech to encrypt creds in a cloud, and using Adobe API to launch the TVE applications. I don't believe Adobe itself powers TVE...it just has a product that can handle the authentication for companies that need it.
So i do not believe Channels is in the same boat, since they use Chrome with your locally stored credentials. I don't think they use Adobe for authentication.
But my understanding could be incorrect.
To see how Adobe fits into the TVE picture, check out the DVR logs. Here is a snippet from mine:
2020/02/07 10:55:12.615294 [TVE] action=navigate url=https://api.auth.adobe.com/api/v1/authenticate?reg_code=QXQKLNN&mso_id=DTV&domain_name=adobe.com&requestor_id=fs2go&noflash=true&redirect_url=https%3A%2F%2Fsp.auth.adobe.com%2Fadobe-services%2FcompletePassiveAuthentication
2020/02/07 10:55:12.616131 [TVE] action=request type=Document method=GET url=https://api.auth.adobe.com/api/v1/authenticate
2020/02/07 10:55:12.852073 [TVE] action=request type=Document method=GET url=https://sp.auth.adobe.com/api/v1/authenticate
2020/02/07 10:55:20.691141 [TVE] action=request type=Document method=POST url=https://sp.auth.adobe.com/sp/saml/SAMLAssertionConsumer
2020/02/07 10:55:20.883417 [TVE] action=request type=Document method=GET url=https://sp.auth.adobe.com/adobe-services/completePassiveAuthentication
As you can see, Adobe is providing the SSO services for TVE providers. However, that's pretty much all they are doing. When you open a stream from a specific provider, Adobe is not involved. Instead, the network website is directly contacted, not any Adobe servers.
In Adobe's Primetime Authentication/DRM overview they specifically mention "Permitting downloads to a content library for local playback at the consumer's convenience".
https://docs.adobe.com/content/help/en/primetime/drm/drm-sdk-5-3-1/overview.html
I wouldn't think there would be anything wrong with how Channels DVR uses this technology. It keeps users subscribed to their cable companies or online streaming services. It's a win-win.
However, doing a bit of digging, I found this message from FitzyTV regarding the Adobe issue (see below). Not sure what the take-away is from this.
To our loyal users,
As you are probably aware, FitzyTV’s apps were suspended from the app stores due to a legal dispute with Adobe, which powers the TV Everywhere system for the cable industry. Adobe is taking the position that allowing our users to watch a channel they’re allowed to watch, on a device they’re allowed to watch it on, using a username and password they’re allowed to use, is a violation of the Computer Fraud & Abuse Act because our software is used to launch the channel. The Electronic Frontier Foundation calls the CFAA “The Worst Law in Technology” as it stifles innovation, allows large corporations to use their monopolistic powers to threaten and intimidate small startups like ours, and “threatens a hallmark of today’s Internet: free and open access to publicly available information.”
While we disagree that we are in violation of the law and have tried for months to work with Adobe to settle the dispute, those efforts have been unsuccessful. In the interest of continuing operations and getting our apps restored, we have agreed to disable the TV Everywhere functionality from the app which will result in all TVE-authenticated channels being removed for the time being. This was a difficult decision to make, but we simply can no longer afford the legal costs to defend ourselves against their allegations while our business suffers due to not being available for download. We are still holding out hope that Adobe takes a pro-innovation stance and comes to the table to discuss how to work together to make a great user experience for TV Everywhere.
If you do not use a cable provider to authenticate, then you can continue to use FitzyTV uninterrupted. We have also continued opening up the platform so that streaming TV providers and developers can more easily directly integrate with us, so stay tuned for more on that. If you would like your provider to integrate directly with us, please reach out to them and have them contact us. If you are a developer and want access to our APIs, please email us at [email protected] for an API key.
If FitzyTV is no longer useful to you without TV Everywhere, you may of course cancel your account at https://www.fitzytv.com/my-account.html.
Thank you for being loyal FitzyTV users, and we hope to continue our mission to simplify the fragmented internet TV ecosystem despite this setback.
Sincerely,
The FitzyTV Team
This topic is poorly named....all is see is complaints over this "FitzyTV" and its future support. Seems they shut down their tve ability because Adobe is after them
All other sources of TVE work fine it seems.
I dont see Adobe being able to tango with the big boys, like Google or Comcast, or Hulu, and winning....to get them to shut of tve for their services.
Apples to oranges.
Can you use TVE without Adobe?
Adobe hosts the servers that authenticate your access to TVE streams/apps.
Here's an analogy to maybe help explain the situation: Think of TV Everywhere as the downtown metro area of a big city. In that city, there are several different clubs or entertainment venues; these clubs/venues are the networks that make their content available via apps and web streams. Now, all of the owners of these clubs and venues have contracted with a private security firm to ensure that only authorized people are allowed into their clubs; this private security is Adobe.
Each network fully controls what content they make available to authorized users. Further, they are the ones actually distributing said content to the users. Adobe is merely the gatekeeper. They run the servers that all users must use to authenticate. So, when you use a TV Everywhere participating website or app, you provide your credentials to the app/site. Then those credentials are verified by Adobe, and they determine whether you're granted access. If you authenticate, then you are allowed to directly access the app/website, and you will receive the content directly from the network/website.
Adobe is only the auth provider; they are the entity manning the door, determining if you can get in or not. However, once you're in, they have no additional role to play.
So why is Channels allowed in, but Not Fitzy? I'm guessing Fitzy is pooling people and Channels is doing it individually
Could it be in the App Access? Channels does not have anything in the App so Amazon Store can not restrict it? Channels Authentication is all in the DVR Server running on a Desktop or NAS.
Well, since FitzyTV has been less than transparent about how their system worked, that isn't completely clear. However, their comment that Adobe is asserting that FitzyTV violated the CFAA, one might infer that FitzyTV was somehow circumventing Adobe's access restrictions.
Channels is accessing the TVE web streams in the exact same manner that you would be doing if you accessed the networks' websites. Channels is using a web browser (Chrome/Chromium) to access the networks' websites. Through the networks' websites, Channels' instance of Chrome is being redirected to Adobe's servers to authenticate. Then, after being properly authenticated, Channels' uses the permission granted to its instance of Chrome to access the networks' websites.
Everything that is done is completely above board.
On the other hand, FitzyTV was storing the networks' content on their own servers—their cloud DVR—and there were implications that they were also circumventing access restrictions; users in one media market often commented that feeds were coming from a different media market than they had access to. Activities such as this are what set Channels and FitzyTV apart.
That's the key, I think. Fitzy was recording on the cloud. That's why services like Play on are still around because you record locally.
as a former fitzy subscriber before finding channels, there may be something to this. there were channels that fitzy allowed me access to that channels doesn't, using the same logins.